I saw on TV today Ireland’s 2007 entry for ‘The most boring advertisement known to man” award. The ad is to advise people how to overtake. To me, this was a complete waste of time for a few reasons.
1) The ad is based on a ordinary 2-way road on which most people learn how to drive and know how to overtake. If you don’t, then you shouldn’t be on the roads. We need to have ad’s on overtaking on motorway’s and dual carriageways. People in this country don’t know that the right-hand lane on these roads is an overtaking lane and not a sit-there-at-speed-limit lane.
2) It is boring. It is very hard to continue to listen to the man talking with his drawn out, departmental speak.
3) The actual recording of the ad is, presumably, the departments idea of being “new age” and “out there”. It really shows nothing and in my own experience how the man in the ad is overtaking takes way too long and you don’t get that amount of time to overtake. I think that it should be much more real to life.
For me the ad just does not get the point across.
Maybe we need to review why accidents are happening and target these issues for ad’s. And for God’s sakes lets ask people what they want or check which are the ad’s people remember the most.
Now, what was the ad about again?
70 Comments
I disagree. Even on the nations regular roads it is possible to see numerous examples of poor and aggressive overtaking.
I agree. That said:
Left lane on motorway travelling at 100
Right lane on motorway travelling at 120,
The guys ‘hanging’ in the right lane shouldn’t move over just because the person behind them wants to break the speed limit.
I disagree, I think there should be more adds like this on TV, there used to be one years back explaining the rules of the yellow box and from my experience that should be on the 24/7. I know several good drivers who have vague recollections of the general rules of the road and anything that reinforces good driving practice is good.
The outside lane on the motorway is not the fast lane-it is the overtaking lane. Why do folk insist on sitting in the outside lane at 120 KPH-it is not their job to enforce the speedlimit.
In reply to Conor above,
The guys hanging in the OVERTAKING lane should absolutley move over. The OVERTAKING lane is for OVERTAKING and thats why its called an OVERTAKING lane. Its idiots like you with that attitude that cause accidents.You’re not a garda and its not your job to police other peoples driving. As a road user you are obliged to use them responsably and safely.
Conor, While I appreciate what your saying, it is not any civilians duty to patrol the roads for speeders that’s the Gardai’s role. We, as civilians should just insure that we ourselves are driving safely, courteously, within the law and if we feel the need to report a dangerous driver then we should.
If someone is driving at the speed limit in the overtaking lane of a motorway/dual-carrigeway, while not actually overtaking they’re in the wrong, endangering themselves and other road users.
As for the ad I agree, it covers what all drivers should have learned before they passed they’re test, however the time is long gone when it is acceptable not to teach and test drivers on motorway driving.
We have been very lucky in this country regarding motorway accidents, how much longer do you think we should push our luck?
Damn my slow typing!
First off it is the Gardai’s job to enforce the law on the road.
Second, by not driving in the left hand lane when not overtaking YOU are braking the law. Hold up a garda doing that lark and he may well pull you over and give you a ticket
Third- the Speedometers fitted to cars may overstate the speed by anything up to 15%. You may think you are doing 120 km/hr, but are actually only doing 105-120. In any case worry about your own speed, not anyone else’s.
People who drive in the right hand lane while not overtaking are idiots. The worst thing about them (apart from the pure annoyance of it) is that they give rise to situations where even greater idiots put your life in danger. I am talking here about the clowns who will start weaving from lane to lane trying to pick their way through the log-jam, jumping from the tail of one car to another. At high speed (100-120km/h), I maintain a gap of c.60m to the car in front. I do this so as to provide myself with an adequate braking response time in the event of an emergency. This gap is not an invitation for an idiot to hop in, thus cutting my available response time in half.
I notice that this safe gap ignorance applies to a very large proportion of drivers. I drive at the speed limit. I admit that I would drive faster on a good dual carriageway but for the fear of getting points. People who drive faster than the limit (within reason) and therefore overtake me do not bother me. However, I hate it when said overtakers start sliding back into my lane when they are no more than 10 meters clear of my car. This is unjustifiable on a dual-carriageway, and can’t even be blamed on frustration. It is just pure THICK!
new to this site but from what i have read you all seem content to blame each other everyone should be considerate enough to other road users and in a perfect world they would be,but it just aint gonna happen. sure ireland has its fair share of bad drivers but so does 90% of europe, the antagonists of this has to surely be the government because if you had a proper driving infrastructure i.e not giving out licences and allowing people to be driving on their 5th to 10th provisional then surely people who take their tests and pass, will have a better understanding of road rules. hope that makes sence.
I will keep this as short as possible. Having viewed what Conor had to say about how a motorway should be used. This driver named is probably typical of a large percentage of Irish drivers I’ll bet you’ll even find Conor driving in the middle lane of our new three-lane motorways. Notice to all drivers like Conor, in this country we drive on the left hand side of the road, regardless of what speed you were doing and at all times keeping as far left as possible. We do not have motorways that have different speed limits according to the lane you driving in I do not believe that speed is the reason for the majority of the accidents on our roads. I personally believe that it’s down to the driving culture of the Irish driver and a total lack of understanding of the rules of the road.
There is something in the Irish driving culture that makes the driver somehow want to prevent all other drivers from overtaking him/her. A perfect example of this and I’m sure you have experienced it yourself. That 9 times out of 10 the majority of Irish drivers are driving in the overtaking lane causing the motorway to be less efficient. On our regional two lane rods they have this incredible urge to drive in the middle of the road and make it extremely difficult for other drivers to overtake them, causing bunching up into small convoys again making it extremely difficult to overtake. I think the majority of Irish drivers think it’s against the law to move into the hard shoulder to allow a passing overtake safely. There are many many other examples I could give you and I have a suggestion that may help to cure this problem.
My suggestion
In my Golf Club from time to time we have a rules night which is a meeting chaired by representatives of the GUI (golfer’s union of Ireland). I’m not sure how many of you are golfer’s, but if you are you will be familiar with the many debates and interpretations that take place over the rules of golf.
I suggest that the Garda traffic core should chair meetings in various locations around the country on the rules of the road. I believe that these meetings should be voluntary and compulsory for some drivers. From time to time some drivers would be stopped by Garda because the driver was doing something stupid and did not know any better possibly a minor infraction and instead of this driver getting a fine that will not cure the drivers ignorance, could be told to go to one of these meetings. I believe that the meeting should start off with a slide show/PowerPoint presentation and that there should be Q&A that would possibly lead to a debate. The drivers that were requested to attend rules night could have their attendance verified by the person/Garda chairing the meeting. I am 100% convinced that the majority of Irish drivers are ignorant of a good percentage of the rules of the road and that the drivers like Conor would have a great deal to learn from this. Incidentally I do not claim to be 100% perfect myself, I believe we can all learn from a good rules night from time to time.
First off, and I’m addressing the comments of “choicer”, congratulations on taking one of the only positive actions the government are doing to improve road safety and blowing holes in it just because it isn’t personally applicable to you. I will now address your 3 points in a way which I hope isn’t too boring for you, which I will get to in your second point…
1. “The ad is based on a ordinary 2-way road on which most people learn how to drive…”
HOW IS THIS A BAD THING???
If most people learn to drive on this sort of road, then this ad is perfectly directed at its target audience. The whole point of the ad is to refresh the technical aspect and procedure for people who have been doing this for years and to give little hints and tips to people, who are not that long driving, and try and take the fear out of a simple manoeuvre. Some people might have been getting away with not checking their mirror before pulling out for years, but see it as an interesting point made in this ad and take it on board.
“If you don’t, then you shouldn’t be on the roads.â€
??? This is a typical bully boy attitude to younger, inexperienced drivers, you have the ‘they’re not as perfect as me so they don’t deserve to be here’ attitude. Part of being a good driver is dealing with everyday occurrences on the road, not trying to ban them. Just because a person mightn’t be able to overtake just yet for whatever reason, is not a good enough reason to rid them from the roads forever… You need to acquire more patience to become a good driver, right now I’d place you in the arrogant category, the type who blows at an upset Learner who’s desperately trying to take it all on board at once.
“We need to have ads on overtaking on motorways and dual carriageways.â€
Firstly, I corrected your grammar.
Secondly, we do have this ad; it came out before this one.
2. “It is boring.â€
I’d like to apologise on behalf of the creators of the ad for not making it entertaining enough for people with a low attention span and high complaint rate. I will request of them to re-design the ad and put more entertaining characters in it for you. How about Barney and the Tellytubbies. Would that make it more entertaining for you?
The whole point of the ad is to be informative. I’m not sure if you know anything about life in general, but to be informative, you need to be direct and to the point. I’m sorry if this upsets you but I think he does a better job than a cartoon character, and the more mature of us can actually understand and relate to the information that is being portrayed in the ad.
3. “The actual recording of the ad is, presumably, the departments idea of being “new age†and “out thereâ€.†– see my response to point 2.
“It really shows nothing and in my own experience how the man in the ad is overtaking takes way too long and you don’t get that amount of time to overtake.â€
I am unaware of the time limit imposed on people to overtake another vehicle; can you please inform me of this limit, so I can avoid whatever punishment it is for “taking too long� As far as I was aware, the only limit on overtaking someone is to get back on the correct side of the road before:
a) Another vehicle is approaches in the opposite direction.
b) The broken white line is comes to an end.
c) You come too close to a corner.
d) You have gone past the vehicle(s) you are overtaking.
Of course, in most of these situations you would not attempt to overtake in the first place, depending on your surroundings and situation. But if you feel that you usually don’t have as long to overtake as the gentleman in the ad, then you are performing a dangerous manoeuvre, by taking a chance in the first place. By rushing these everyday and potentially safe actions, you introduce an element of danger, and it’s actions like these that go wrong and cause the majority of our poor road statistics.
So in conclusion, and by interpreting Your Own Words, the general public can see that you are arrogant, impatient, have a low attention span, could do with a few more English lessons and are a dangerous driver.
However, in the midst of this rant that showed off your true traits, you did happen to make one valid statement!!!
“People in this country don’t know that the right-hand lane on these roads is an overtaking lane and not a sit-there-at-speed-limit lane.â€
What we can all learn from this that everyone seems to have that “one answer†to solve the whole road safety problem, but in this person’s rant about one point, they showed how bad a driver they are in other aspects. Fair enough, it is a very important issue to return to the left lane on a dual carriageway when it is clear, but overtaking is a much more important issue as you add oncoming traffic into the equation also. The government realise this from their access to the statistics that this is an issue. And this is one of the best things they have done towards road safety. The previous ad that I referred to earlier, the “Returning to left hand lane†ad, had a noticeable effect on the dual carriageway that I drive every day to work, but went back to normal once the ad was taken off the air.
I say run these ads, for a month straight on all Irish stations at peak times, and let’s see the difference for ourselves.
Your blog suggests that it’s ok to speed in the right lane.
Personally I hate when cars come speeding from behind. I think the ad is useful since you do not seem to know that the speed limit is the speed limit.
Speeding causes accidents, and if you are overtaking above the speed limit, you are breaking the law and I will not aid you by moving over.
“Speeding causes accidents, and if you are overtaking above the speed limit, you are breaking the law and I will not aid you by moving over.”
But you wouldn’t have to move over if you were in the left hand lane to start with! Take a look at the rules of the road.
People clearly need to go back and read the rules of the road. The speed that is used on all large roads is just terrible. I see it every day driving from Wexford to Wateford. The dumb look on people’s faces when you question their driving! Really by the time you reach your home you phyiscally wreaked from worrying if the person that’s sitting on or flying up you hole is going to try and overtake you. You dread every day
Reply to Mark
Do you have any idea of how stupid your statement is?
“Speeding causes accidents, and if you are overtaking above the speed limit, you are breaking the law and I will not aid you by moving over”
Now when you made the above statement I assume you wear talking about driving on our typical two-lane roads at 100 kph?
First of all just because your speedometer indicates to you that you are travelling at 100 kph, just how accurate do you think your speedometer is? Some cars can be out by as much as 10 kph at a speed of 100 kph. So if think you’re travelling at 100 kph there is a very good possibility that you really only travelling at 90 kph. Sometimes a local Corporation or Council in your area may have installed a speed camera system with a large display that will tell you what speed you were travelling at. If you can find one of these in an area that has a speed limit of 100 kph or greater use this system to check the accuracy of your speedometer, I think you’ll find a big surprise.
I use a GPS that will give me an accuracy of 5 metres sometimes 2 metres depending on the how good the satellite reception. I also drive using cruise control at the speed limit. (Using cruise control will prevent drivers from accidentally driving over the speed limit.)
So anyway I’m driving along at 100 kph to an accuracy of approximately 5 metres which is very accurate and slowly but surely what do I see in the distance only Mark or the likes of him driving along in the middle of the road thinking he is driving at 100 kph when in actual fact he’s only doing 90 kph. So does mark move over into the hard shoulder, No he does not, Mark decides that I am speeding and decides to stay out there in the middle of the road and thinks to himself, I am not going to a aid you in overtaking me. I’m going to make it as difficult as I can for you because in my opinion you are speeding and you shouldn’t speed. (what an ass) because of Marks clever driving I now have to take my car off cruise control and slow down to 90 kph and wait for an opportunity to overtake him. In this type of situation is next to impossible to overtake this type of driver without exceeding the speed limit. If the likes of Mark were banned from driving there would be far less carnage on the roads today.
So Mark go get your speedometer calibrated. Anyway you have no right in restricting drivers in any shape or form.
I wouldn’t move over onto the hard shoulder either, not because of any half baked ideas that I’m teaching you a lesson, but simply because to do so would be an illegal manoeuvre. And as for having taking the car off cruise control, what a tough life you lead. I’m afraid I also miss your reasoning behind banning ‘the likes of mark’ from the roads, all he is doing is driving at a speed which he, for whatever reason, deems appropriate for the given scenario. In my mind the liklihood is that its ‘the likes of you’ will be the cause of any carnage by becoming impatient at marks resistance to bow to your absolute need to travel at precisely the speed limit (to within 2 metres, of course) and will try to pass where you shouldn’t, in your haste you will have invariably misjudged the speed of the incoming car and will cut across our mark or simply start to drift in and expect him to slow down, again I wouldn’t; you’ll find your brake pedal is the one in the middle.
The ROTR state that you may pull over briefly on to the hard shoulder to let faster moving traffic past you, IF it safe to do so.
You cannot, of course, do this on a MOTORWAY.
Of course, on a motorway or dual carriageway you should only be in the right hand lane if overtaking; or if, in the case of a dual carriageway, you will shortly be making a right hand turn.
I’ve met the likes of Ray many times.
Sitting as far in the middle as possible, slightly speeding up as you overtake him and generally being as difficult as possible when people are trying to overtake him.
Sooner or later he will provoke someone into overtaking him in desperation when it’s not strictly safe or legal to do so, mistakes will be made and they will both end up in the ditch, as I have seen it many times.
Ray can then bask in the glory of his righteous deed on the way to the A&E department or morgue, but at least he taught that other bastard a lesson, if he’s still alive to appreciate it.
If someone wants to overtake me, I move out of the way, maintain my speed and even indicate left to show the way is clear.
That way I don’t have someone sitting on my tail for the next 10 miles who is hellbent on getting past me any which way.
I’d rather have that guy in front of me.
Let Ray kill himself and the other guy, I prefer to get home in 1.
Excellent opinion John, what kind of do-goody idiot deems it necessary to put their life in danger for nothing else but to try and prove a point and show the utmost arrogance whilst doing so.
As Seamus said, 9 times out of 10, these people are not even speeding anyway, yet people like not-so-bright-ray feel it’s their place to act like this on our already dangerous public roads.
Just out of interest ray, would you do this on stairs in a public place too? .. Walk in the middle so people can’t pass by you?
I’d love to know what goes on in your head when you are blocking traffic in a dangerous way such as this?
Do you feel you are providing some sort of service by turning yourself into a dangerous obstacle?
Does it make you smile?
I’d really appreciate a reply, if you can manage that…
This is one of my personal pet peeves. The road system in Ireland just can’t handle the inconsiderate nature of so many drivers. Take as a prime example the road between Limerick and Galway, this is a national primary road and for the most part has a 100kph limit. I can’t count the number of times I have been stuck behind people who insist on driving between 60 and 80kph and will not leave you past. This road is quite twisty and there are not that many places to safely overtake. I really wish that someone could get across to these people that driving to slow on a main road is just as dangerous as driving too fast. If they are not confident enough to control their car then they shouldn’t carry a license to drive!
One of the worst incidents of blatant ignorance I have come across was after getting off the Ferry in Roslare from France, I was driving to Cork, on the road there are many places with climbing lanes, I got stuck behind a woman in a red fiesta, who insisted on driving in the overtaking lane at 70kph, she would not let me overtake, I flashed the lights she didn’t pull over…. I did it again she didn’t budge…. each time I gave her time to pull over but she never would. Eventually on the 3rd climbing lane after flashing the lights numerous occasions I leaned on the horn…. This seemed to scare her out of her private day dream as she swerved violently…. ….but guess what… STAYED in the middle of the road… If I was less safety conscious I may have been tempted to overtake somewhere that it was not 100% safe, but I refuse to put my own life and the life of others at risk because of the dumb, witless and inconsiderate Irish motorists that seem to exist. This woman was blatantly flouting the rules of the road… and probably thought she was totally in the right. Grrrr… Thanks for providing a great place to rant… pity we can’t name and shame…. or go a step further to somehow educate these people that got their driving licenses in lucky bags.
Friend of mine was driving on the road by tivioli in Cork, 100 zone that drops to 60 rather quickly, prime speed trap place, well he was doing 100 in the right hand lane with a car stuck up behind him, he stayed in the right hand lane down to 60, where the 2 lanes merged into 1, where the car behind him turned off up to the left, the second car behind him then flashed him and put on it’s lights an unmarked Garda car and pulled him over, saying why didn’t he pull over and let the car pass him, he said he was at the speed limit, to which the Garda said he was waiting for the car to speed pass him and catch him going over the limit…..somedays one just can’t win !!!!!!!!
That’s the problem with the Gardai. When they do come out they are in unmarked vehicles. How fair is that?
The marked Traffic Corp vehcile is a deterent and so contributes to safety. All the unmarked vehicle accomplishes is revenue and fines.
We have not yet gotten to grips with the concept that the Toyota behind might be an unmarked Garda vehicle. Or should it be a Garda unmarked vehicle. Well both I suppose. Neither is marked.
The undertakers love the overtakers.
@Pete – Brilliant story. A tragedy of missed opportunity where the hero does the right thing and becomes the unwitting villain.
Reply to Ray regarding overtaking on our national two-lane roads
You made a statement and I quote “I wouldn’t move over onto the hard shoulder either, not because of any half baked ideas that I’m teaching you a lesson, but simply because to do so would be an illegal manoeuvre.”
Do you have any idea of how ignorant that statement of your’s is? It’s obviously long time since you read the rules of the road. The road safety authority in conjunction with the Irish Insurance Federation are currently in the middle of a programme that promises to issue every household in the country with the latest copy of the rules of the road, you obviously have not received yours yet? Could I suggest that you get your hands on a copy and when you do could you please look at page number 60 under the heading of “Road Markings”? When you have done this you will learn that it is not an illegal manoeuvre to move into the hard shoulder and allow faster traffic over take you safely.
What possible benefit could you find in holding up traffic regardless of what speed you were doing/what speed you think you are doing (referring back to the in accuracy of the majority of speedometers a our vehicles today)? What possible pleasure could you get out of having a convoy of cars behind you, you ignorant ass?
I’m not going to explain the benefits of using cruise control again to you for two reasons, one, because you are ignorant, two because you probably don’t have cruise control on your own vehicle and therefore you wouldn’t understand the enormous benefits to having cruise control.
Séamus
I had a theory that once upon a time the speed limit was 50mph/80kph. I thought that some of those drivers who have driven in the period up to now never noted that the speed limit had changed and continued to drive at the same old speed limit thus creating a procession of traffic behind them…I also wondered if those procession-makers ever used their rear-view mirrors such was their blissful ignorance of what was going on behind them…until I read this site…I now realise that these people were actually doing their civil duty and the equivalent of a citizens arrest on the roads…thank you
I was thinking of fixing a loudspeaker to my car (just like the ones they had for the general elections in years gone by). When I come across these types of drivers I could declare my presence to their surprised selves and ask them why are they driving in such a clueless manner! Some day…
Now that actually crossed my mind may times too! These mindless people and these people who are way too busy texting on their mobiles please please just look in your mirrors now again like your supposed to!
And another thing when you do actually think about looking in your mirrors………… try and remember that ALL the cars that are lined up behind you that want to pass, are actually not all bad people or are not people who want to drive side by side with you but we do actually want to pass you as you are actually going at a hazzardous speed. In this day and ages cars Do have another gear they call 5th (and if your really really lucky and know how to manage your money right, you might be driving a vehicle that has indeed 6 gears)!……..but anyway we kinda want to get to where we’re going before the day ends.
The problem with threads like this is that thye are quickly ruined by invective and hectoring from the likes of Séamus. Is he the owner of the road perhaps. Is he the only one with a 100% accurate speedometer or GPS?
Congratulations Séamus on being wonderboy. The perfect driver. He who must be allowed to pass because he has “Cruise Control”. You too could have “Crusie Control” by simply being pretentious enough. Would I be correct in assuming Séamus is a teacher. That would account for the self-importance and dictitorial personality.
Please stop spoiling the site by lecturing the rest of us. Keep to the issue – driving.
Ceanna Claar said:
The problem with threads like this is that thye are quickly ruined by invective and hectoring from the likes of Séamus. Is he the owner of the road perhaps. Is he the only one with a 100% accurate speedometer or GPS?
What is your problem woman?
I bet you are that lady that sits in the fast lane at 80 km/h for 20 miles not letting anyone pass.
You complain about hectoring, yet you have nothing whatsoever to contribute to the bones of this argument.
You point out that Seamus has Cruise Control, well done, give that woman the Nobel price for literature!
I believe it is your own self importance, mixed with a few too many glasses of red and a tub of Häagen-Dazs that pushed you to write this post.
Where to start…first off I didn’t realise you were allowed to cross onto the hard shoulder and I will consider it in the future. That said I have never been the cause of a convoy of cars behind me.
“Sooner or later he will provoke someone into overtaking him in desperation when it’s not strictly safe or legal to do so”, I take your point that it is irritating when you want to pass but can’t, but as for being ‘provoked’ to pass? Bullshit. You’re the driver if you pass when you know its not safe it’s all on you.
John: “I believe it is your own self importance, mixed with a few too many glasses of red and a tub of Häagen-Dazs that pushed you to write this post”, I bet you’re actually really quiet in public, cop on and stop being such a bitch.
Seamus, no I don’t have cruise control, I don’t want to have cruise control, and I don’t care that you have cruise control.
I thought this site would be good but as Ceanna said its just becoming one big bitching session for the ignorant the arrogant the pretentious and the just plain stupid, oh and me aswell.
Right have at it…
Reply to Ceanna Claar
Ceanna what is your problem?
You said “The problem with threads like this is that they are quickly ruined by invective and hectoring from the likes of Séamus. Is he the owner of the road perhaps. Is he the only one with a 100% accurate speedometer or GPS?”
My reply:
No I do not believe I am the owner of our roads. All I want to be able to do is drive at the speed limit when I believe it is safe to do so. When I drive on our national two-lane roads at 100 kph with a hundred percent confidence that I am doing this speed to within 5 metres pair hour accuracy. Like it or not, that is how accurate my GPS system is and I don’t want to get into a debate about how and why GPS Systems are so accurate nowadays, after all this website is about driving and it would not be fair to the other users of this website, so Ceanna build a bridge and get over it. No I do not believe I am the only driver with an acrid speedometer, I very rarely catch up on any one else with 100% accuracy because invariably they are doing the same speed as me. So to repeat, No I do not believe I am the owner of our roads, all I want is to be able to drive at the speed limit when safe to do so and when I catch up on a slow or driver I do expect that the slower driver to have noticed true his or her regular use of the rear-view mirror that I am approaching and as a courtesy to another driver that he or she would move into the hard shoulder and allow me pass assuming it is safe to do so. I am certainly courteous to other drivers that are driving faster than me and believe me there are plenty of them. Now question to you Ceanna, does this attitude of mine still make you believe that I think I am the owner of our roads?
You also said a “Congratulations Séamus on being wonderboy. The perfect driver. He who must be allowed to pass because he has “Cruise Controlâ€. You too could have “Crusie Control†by simply being pretentious enough. Would I be correct in assuming Séamus is a teacher. That would account for the self-importance and dictitorial personality.
My reply:
Question to you Ceanna, have you ever driven abroad? I know I have driven in many many countries and rarely have I seen a nation of drivers worse than the examples one can experience while driving in Ireland. Try driving from Holyhead to the south of Spain I guarantee you during the likes of this drive you will see some perfect examples of good driving, admittedly most of this driving would be motorway driving and that’s a whole different debate because we’re talking about national two-lane roads in Ireland. But if you want to move this debate up a gear to a debate about motorway driving believe me I have plenty of ammunition just let me know. So I don’t necessarily consider myself a perfect driver, I do believe I am a very experienced and very well-travelled driver with worldwide experience and I most certainly have enough experience to identify a bad driver/shite drivers.
So you think I’m pretentious because I have cruise control. I now have this image in my head that you think I am driving a 7 series BMW or some such like, is my assumption correct? The vehicle I use for work is a Mercedes Sprinter van and currently this is the vehicle I do most of my driving in. Your assumption about Séamus being a teacher is so far off the mark you may as well be on the moon, I am in the plumbing business hence the reason for the van.
You accuse me of having a dictatorial personality this because I educated Mark that it was actually not an illegal manoeuvre to use the hard shoulder on our national two-lane roads, OK maybe you got me on that one. I corrected someone who was wrong not only did I correct Mark maybe I corrected others that were of the same opinion as Mark, if that makes me dictatorial, then I am. If you were having a debate with someone and you know their opinion is incorrect are you telling me that you would not correct them also?
Reply to Ray
I am delighted that you now have a better understanding of how the hard shoulder should be used on our national two-lane roads.
In my opinion you were totally incorrect for picking on John. I believe John was quite correct in pointing out that Ceanna did not actually add to the debate. All she seems to do was slag me off and make loads of incorrect assumptions about me and what I do for a living.
Regarding the cruise control and your ridiculous statement about my having it. I believe that without cruise control it is possible for a driver to accidentally find themselves driving over the speed limit and one of the basic functions of cruise control is to prevent this. There’s nothing pretentious about having cruise control and I certainly consider it to be it a safety feature on my vehicle. It sounds like to me that you were knocking it without trying it. There is a lot more I could say on the subject, but you’ll be glad to know that I am not going to bother to open a closed mind.
In your last paragraph, I don’t understand how you could exclude yourself from the ignorant. When you actually started your posting you admitted to learning something new, which put you in the category of the ignorant, am I wrong?
ahhh Ceanna, theirs an unmarked car in cork thats a Skoda Octavia thats catching a lot of people atm.. so the car behind..may not be a toyota…which is an amusing cliche for the toyota ad before, that the car in front is a toyota.. while the car behind…MUST be a skoda….lol..
..damn, I’m talking crap already this morning and it’s only 9.11…. hhhmmmmm…
I am a Brit. I live in Ireland. The general standard of driving is appauling over here, and I have driven on 3 different continents on this planet. – Just don’t get me started on the Irish inconsiderate “methods” of parking!
My boss recently went to the UK. He asked how he should drive, i told him, drive how everybody else drives.
He came back and said he went dizzy with the driving, pulling out, overtaking, pulling in, but he did comment that he was doing 75mph in the slow lane!
It is true. English roads, are better than some irish roads.
The biggest problem I’ve seen is people that try to overtake, but do it very slowly!! Meaning that other traffic cannot overtake.
In a couple of situations on the N7 I have actually been overtaking 4 cars abrest, me being the outer car, I only have 90bhp, but obivoulsy I can use it! (I didn’t so more than 80mph on a good road surafce with 1miles forward visibility) It may be reckless, but I know my car, I know what it can do, and if there is nothing coming I will do it again.
Why should I sit behind someone travelling below the speedlimit, If I don’t want to? The UK highway code does say to overtake as quickly and safely as possible.
Can anyone explain this scenario, which happens all too often:
You are driving on an almost empty motorway (it happens sometimes!) at 120. You come up behind a car doing 90 in the outer lane when there is no one – no one at all – in the inner lane. As you approach you flash – gently, nothing aggressive, no tailgating or anything. Our friend indicates left, moves over, and you go past, relieved, but wondering why car was out there in the first place.
Then, in your mirror, you see car go back out into outer lane on the still-empty motorway.
Have I missed something here, or can anyone else get inside the mindset of this behaviour?
Hi,
As much as I don’t understand this behaviour either I do not agree with flashing people. I was never told to do so by my driving instructor. Just overtake these unaware people on the left (which is also wrong) and everybody lives happily after. I think the reason why these people drive in this lane is that they never get a chance to do so when the road is busy.
You know, Freelander,
I’d be willing to take a punt on them being Polish. Lovely people, but old habits die hard.
Hello. Jaysus people, keep is short. War and fucking peace hah? Road Runner – Golf is a fucking waste of a good walk (W B Fields) and Noel, stick da cruise control on and sat nav your way to a good proof reader to trim that lecture down man. Overtaking lane. Do what is says on the tin. Overtake, keep left thereafter. Simple. Yes, speedometers are invariably out by about 10kph usually but your arguement is flawed – overtake when safe and legal to do so. Flashing, it’s illegal and could get you locked up but the rules of the road say it’s actually not good idea to flash your headlights at another driver, believe it or not. Polish people arent bad drivers believe it not too but some of their fellow Eastern-European bedfellows are prime fodder for shitedrivers.com.
Disco Chav: Dead on, and that’s what would happen in a perfect world.
Flashing someone once is not illegal if it’s to alert him of your presence, even 90% of the time it’s no good, cause most people blocking the fast lane have trouble seeing what’s going on around them with their head up their arse.
Undertaking is a definite no-no, unless you’re in a line of traffic that happens to move faster on the left.
In Germany there are people deliberately blocking the fast lane of the autobahn, the passenger has a video camera and they shop anyone to the cops who passes them on the wrong side.
Automatic points and penalty and nothing you can do about it.
Those Germans can be pretty nasty too…
Same goes for flashing and tailgating.
Theoretically there’s nothing you can do when someone blocks the fast lane out of spite and malice.
You can’t make them move in, you can’t flash or tailgate and you certainly can’t pass on the inside.
And they know that and it makes their shitty little lives a little less miserable.
Actually, in the UK it was ruled that blocking the fast lane of the Motorway is ok. Jeremy Clarkson had this to say:
I know where the paedophiles are. If you drive down the outside lane of a motorway now, not retuning the radio, at 50mph, you are immune from prosecution OK. So it’s the ideal place to go if you’re being looked for by the law… So therefore anyone..doing 50..in the outside lane of a motorway..is a child molester…
In Reply to John Smiths Mail.
Its not “Fast Lane” its the overtaking lane and it should be used for that purpose only.
You come up behind slower moveing traffic, you do your OSM (observe, signal,manouver) and as soon as it is safe to do so you move back into your lane.
A good driver will not hang obout in the overtaking lane. The prime example of this is on the M50 where there is a queue in the overtaking lane and lane one is free of traffice. the Naas road three lane carriageway is an other example of bad driveing. You could drive from Naas to newlands cross useing the first lane overtaking all the bad drivers stuck out in lane 2 and 3.
The rule is always leave the overtaking lane free for faster moving traffic
Disco Chav, absolutely they are fine drivers, the Polish. But on the side of the road they’re used to. In the middle of the night on a deserted road it’s easy to forget you’re in a foreign land. Look at the number of Brits that get creamed annually on their ollerdize as soon as they step into the hire car.
Dustbubble I heard Italians are the worst offenders for dat craic, in fact some well-know hire car companies here wont even underwrite them coz of the tendancy to keep right once bored looking at the ring of kerry…
John, don’t mind that long string of piss Clarkeson, don’t wanna know where he was goin’ with that customery comment of controversy…
Wrong, wrong, wrong John Smith!
You said “Undertaking is a definite no-no, unless you’re in a line of traffic that happens to move faster on the left.”
Check the rules of the road again.
You must normally overtake on the right. However, you are allowed to overtake on the left in the situations listed below.
You may overtake on the left when:_
* You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that they intend to turn right.
* You have signalled that you intend to turn left.
* Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane.
Only half right John Smith. But then a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Ask any shite driver. !0 out of 10 for effort though. Can you tell me for another 10 marks what this piece of legislation that you quoted in support of your arguement (wrongly) actually refers to
You said “Undertaking is a definite no-no, unless you’re in a line of traffic that happens to move faster on the left.â€
That is NOT what the rules of the road say.
There is NO circumstance when this would apply to driving on a motorway for example. This WAS the circumstance that you were referring to in your post.
The Road Traffic General Bye Laws (1964) specifically state that it is acceptable to overtake on the left “in slow-moving traffic, when vehicles in the traffic lane on the driver’s right are moving more slowly than the overtaking vehicle.”
Read John Smiths reply to the topic of overtakin/undertaking on the MOTORWAY Niall.
On September 2nd, 2007 at 11:23 pm
John Smith said:
You must normally overtake on the right. However, you are allowed to overtake on the left in the situations listed below.
You may overtake on the left when:_
* You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that they intend to turn right.
* You have signalled that you intend to turn left.
* Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane.
When you do read it, have a long think before you reply. This section of law does NOT apply to driving on the MOTORWAY. Geddit?
That section of the law applies to multi-lane traffic. Where in the law does it specifically state that it doesn’t apply to motorways?
Overtaking
Overtake only on the right, unless traffic is travelling in slow moving queues and the traffic queue on your right is travelling more slowly than you are. If you intend to move from a slower lane to a faster lane, adjust your speed first.
As applicable to Motorways
And if we actually had any proper enforcement the guards would check for slow drivers in the fast lane, other than the actual “tax, insurance, grand”
Yet another post by Miaowww removed for being ignorant and condescending. He’ll get the message eventually… maybe.
He was trying to put the point across that these rules didn’t apply to motorways as the person in front of you is unlikely to be turning right. He, of course, ignored the rule which says you CAN overtake on the left when “traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane” which DOES apply to motorways.
He asked what motorway was built in 1964 (when the law was enacted). This is hardly relevant as the law makes no distinction regarding the class of road the driving is done on.
The section of law you and John Smith are relying on refers to JUNCTIONS. There are NO right turns on a MOTORWAY.
There is nothing ignorant or condescending in this post. I have just pointed out the error in much the same way that you have done in previous posts. Shite drivers eh?
Those parts which refer to a vehicle TURNING – i.e.: these parts:
* You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that they intend to turn right.
* You have signalled that you intend to turn left.
- THOSE certainly refer to junctions.
However, the other time when overtaking on the left is deemed allowable, i.e.:
“in slow-moving traffic, when vehicles in the traffic lane on the driver’s right are moving more slowly than the overtaking vehicle.â€
does NOT refer to a junction, it refers to slow-moving multi-lane traffic, which VERY MUCH CAN apply to a motorway.
Niall, Niall, Niall.
The section of law quoted cannot apply to Motorways for the reasons quoted by John Smith. Turning left, straight ahead and turning right applies to a junction and not a Motorway.
Logic is little tweeting bird chirping in meadow. Logic is wreath of pretty flowers that smell bad.
Miaowww, I agree that the portions regarding turning left and right don’t apply to a motorway (albeit, it’s not illegal to overtake someone on the left when they’re in the left lane and you’re going along a slip-lane to leave the motorway, is it? … that would cover the ‘you turning left’ option… turning right on a motorway – no, that doesn’t apply.)
- BUT – the final portion which refers to two lanes of slow-moving traffic where the vehicles in the traffic lane on the driver’s right are moving more slowly – how can you say that can’t apply to a motorway?
Niall,
That is called leaving the motorway via a slip road or exit ramp on the lane made and provided for such purpose. It is not called turning left.
To restate my argument.
John Smith was half right when he said that one could over/undertake on the motorway and then went on to quote a law that applied to driving on roads other than motorways.
When Motorways were constructed in Ireland laws were passed to take account of these new roads and methods of driving.
The second part of your post is correct.
John,
If I may change your quote a little to this.
Logic is a Guard driving behind you in an unmarked Subaru Forester.
Logic is the last driver that does something wrong is the first one the Guard will see.
Fergus,
I hope your driving is better than your grammar and spelling. Jaysus!
Jason: Picking on someones grammar and spelling and not the points they make is frankly pointless and contributes nothing to the discussion.
whooaaa hold on where are you getting your laws from.
The Rules of the Road are NOT the detailed Law. The Law is as laid passed by the Oireachtas in Primary and secondary legislation , and added to by local council bye-laws.
Undertaking is allowed when when the outer lane is going slower. End. of . Story.
here is the EXACT definition of the law.
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1964/en/si/0294.html#zzsi294y1964a19
That bit of the law does not say that undertaking is allowed when the outer lane is going slower, it says “in slow-moving traffic, when vehicles in the traffic lane on the driver’s right are moving more slowly than the overtaking vehicle.” – copied and pasted so as not to make any errors. The critical words for me are “in slow-moving traffic”. This applies on e.g. the M50 in rush hour (sic) and times when traffic is slow or crawling. It does not apply normal driving on motorways when some dingbat is doing 90 in the overtaking lane and someone undertakes at 120.
I looked everywhere and there does not seem to be any one rule prohibiting overtaking on the left.
The current rules of the road say “overtake only on the right unless traffic is moving in slow moving queues, etc…”
Also the point system has enough nebulous and wishy washy definitions that the guards could nick you for nothing every day of the week, as long as they can say “well, I THINK he was driving dangerously”
And in any case there’s dangerous overtaking. Since overtaking always has an element of risk it could be argued that ANYTIME you overtake it’s dangerous. Let alone on the left.
Sadly this seems to give numb nuts blocking the fast lane at 90 card blanche.
Flashing and beeping him could be construed as roadrage, coupled with undertaking could land you in a heap of trouble.
One could argue that blocking the fast lane might be construed as “driving without reasonable consideration” and that’s a points and fixed penalty offense. But to make that stick you will need evidence, witnesses, etc… and it’s not worth your while.
So, things are looking bleak, unless you’re the guy blocking the fast lane at 70-90 km/h, in which case, keep up the good work, good man, well done, everyone loves you and no one can tell you to move.
I’m still building up my defense of “temporary insanity”. I might need it one day.
I never flash or blow the horn when somebody is blocking the overtaking lane. I calmy undertake them on the left and they usually pull in after I pass (probably due to embarrasment).
I drive a Nissan Almera diesel as a daily driver and probably carry out the above manouver twice a day.
However, on Friday last I decided to treat myself and bring my Nissan Skyline. I carried out the above manouver which resulted in a middle aged man stuck to my bumper with one hand on his mobile phone, his other repeatedly “giving me the finger”, and plenty of flashing lights for good measure. How he managed to complete all these tasks and keep his car in a straight line is beyond me……..
My apologies.. I posted an old 1964 link. A more current version, including Motorway rules can be found at
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/1997/en/si/0182.html#zzsi182y1997a9
I can’t find a later update than that. This is the exact rules of the road.
Best remedy:
Provoke the other person and have your passenger film them.
It’s their word against your video recording of them beeping, flashing, giving the finger, etc…
Unfair, mean, below the belt, but some people will never learn otherwise.
What?
In response to Noel.
Perhaps check your own spelling and grammar before complaining about Choicer’s. See “b) The broken white line is comes to an end.
”
and perhaps research the correct use of the comma.
Mike